tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post2482441078588940459..comments2023-10-07T02:42:10.642-07:00Comments on Coalition for Kid-Friendly Schools: The Pleasure of Making Somebody Else Work HardFedUpMomhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00951858601020687242noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-82934486693592846722013-09-21T19:09:33.399-07:002013-09-21T19:09:33.399-07:00Where I live, you are allowed to drop out of schoo...Where I live, you are allowed to drop out of school after Year 10 provided you start an apprenticeship or go to a vocational skill or something along those lines. For some people, particularly those who know what they like doing and know that the school environment isn't right for them, this is the right choice. I know someone who was into computers, but his school didn't offer good computing courses, plus he didn't like the other subjects that he had to take, so he went and studied information technology at a vocational school and has now landed himself a job. He's probably in a better position now than he would have been if he had just struggled on through finishing school.Hienuri Kayleuetskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11706477882374399244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-75336616790066935362013-06-05T18:25:26.291-07:002013-06-05T18:25:26.291-07:00HWB, I might have to moderate comments. I'd s...HWB, I might have to moderate comments. I'd still have to look at the stinkin' spam, but you wouldn't. You'd have to wait to see your comments up in lights, though.FedUpMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00951858601020687242noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-80120295183372543562013-06-05T12:56:28.361-07:002013-06-05T12:56:28.361-07:00The SPAM on this site drives me nuts. I'm sure...The SPAM on this site drives me nuts. I'm sure it does you too. Any way to permanently block them? I suppose not.HomeworkBluesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-80266838197328551602013-05-05T18:25:14.490-07:002013-05-05T18:25:14.490-07:00'I was struck by his point that we have an old...'I was struck by his point that we have an old-fashioned hierarchy of work (thinking, for instance, that working in an office is superior to working with your hands)'<br /><br />Agreed. I question this hierarchy even when it pertains to power structures within companies: here you have managers earning higher salaries and prestige than, say, the programmers they manage, when the programmers may well be working at least as hard and deploying at least as much talent.<br /><br />'I have several times heard myself say "Quick! Call a plumber!" but I have never said "Quick! Call a post-modernist!"'<br /><br />Absolutely. I loved how my son's freshman engineering school orientation began with "engineers solve problems." (My mental segueway: "... while postmodernists 'problematize.'")Katharine Bealshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02838879769628392605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-67350400382345146802013-04-13T07:21:13.135-07:002013-04-13T07:21:13.135-07:00"There are only so many hours in a day, and h..."There are only so many hours in a day, and human beings are only capable of so much scholarly work at a time. Are we burning kids out? What do they no longer have time for because of the workload?"<br /><br />I totally agree about there being such a thing as too much homework. I wrote an article for a group of local magazines about that very thing: http://bellairebuzz.com/2012/08/home-over-homework/.<br /><br />And yes, why do teachers have to rush through lessons because they are on some kind of timeline? I guess I get that they know what their students will face next, in high school once they are out of middle school, for example, but, in doing that, they sometimes seem to forget to consider their actual students: what they know, what they're still shaky on, etc.<br /><br />http://fewbricksshy.blogspot.com/Cheryl Ursinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04922520656253488465noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-68051820044253281322013-04-12T06:52:47.367-07:002013-04-12T06:52:47.367-07:00More than that FedUpMom...the big "They"...More than that FedUpMom...the big "They" are saying it's the only path.<br /><br />This is where Seth Godin has been influencing me, because he has been promoting the idea that what each individual can contirbute, that's unique, is the stuff that can't be outsourced. It's a mistake to tell kids to ignore what they love because it isn't profitable. Better to teach them how to make it profitable, whatever it is, because if they love it they will put their heart and soul into it. Those skills are far reaching and life changing. And if enough people start creating new things, who knows what will come of it.<br /><br />I agree with you...I think I'm becoming an anti-academic.<br /><br />"Quick, Call a Post-Modernist" is a great title for a blog post.PsychMomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-7488281540332394692013-04-11T16:56:26.621-07:002013-04-11T16:56:26.621-07:00Chris, PsychMom -- I like the way you think! I ha...Chris, PsychMom -- I like the way you think! I haven't read the "Soulcraft" book, but I read reviews when it first came out, and I was struck by his point that we have an old-fashioned hierarchy of work (thinking, for instance, that working in an office is superior to working with your hands), but we're swiftly entering a world where work will exist in two categories: work that can be outsourced and work that can't be outsourced. Plumbing can't be outsourced, but mid-level legal and other "head" work can.<br /><br />I have several times heard myself say "Quick! Call a plumber!" but I have never said "Quick! Call a post-modernist!"<br /><br />I'm not anti-intellectual, but I think I'm becoming anti-academic in some ways. At least, I don't think there's much of a future in academic degrees for most young people. If they want an academic degree they should be aware that there might not be a relevant job at the end of it. <br /><br />I think it's a shame that so many young adults are burdened with enormous debt that they took on to get a degree which might not lead to a well-paid job. I don't think it's entirely their fault, either. Everyone and her dog tells high school students that college is the right path.FedUpMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00951858601020687242noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-66826369497323084052013-04-11T16:34:05.120-07:002013-04-11T16:34:05.120-07:00I will definitely get it Chris..sounds like it'...I will definitely get it Chris..sounds like it's right up my alley. <br />There's a local woman who has developed a furniture making business, but her pieces are more like artwork and she charges accordingly. With the future heading towards recycling and having things that last, I just think having building skills will take you very far. Combining those skills with art......it's a niche that hasn't been fully explored yet.<br />I haven't gone anti-intellectual at all...I just think the internet allows us to know things at the pace we want to know them...and for some kids, going to university at 26 or 27 may make much more sense than at 17 or 18. It also may take them less time to get university degrees later in life.<br />Considering something other than university after high school is not limiting choices to my mind. Learning a trade is an alternative to competing with the loads of degreed unemployed 20 somethings...PsychMomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-17566893499214000712013-04-11T14:59:54.795-07:002013-04-11T14:59:54.795-07:00PsychMom -- Have you read Shop Class as Soulcraft,...PsychMom -- Have you read <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Shop-Class-Soulcraft-Inquiry-Value/dp/0143117467" rel="nofollow">Shop Class as Soulcraft</a>, by Matthew Crawford? It's a really interesting book arguing that skilled trades are more fulfilling (not to mention less likely to be outsourced) than many jobs considered to be more desirable. The author is a philosophy Ph.D. who left his job as director of a Washington think tank to open a motorcycle repair shop. I'm only mid-way through the book, but am enjoying it.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07559356125770114400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-75212540613314266232013-04-11T06:36:57.276-07:002013-04-11T06:36:57.276-07:00In the Globe and Mail yesterday, I noticed one of ...In the Globe and Mail yesterday, I noticed one of the political cartoonists drew a picture of a fast food eatery, with the server behind the counter saying, "Did you want a dissertation with that?"<br /><br />Personally, I'm putting bugs in my daughter's ear about the skilled trades. She is artistic and likes concrete tasks that have a beginning and an end. She's a "work-like-mad", "just tell me what you want done", "what's the bottom line", type of person. Oh, and she also likes making a mess. Ok, so maybe I just have a regular 12 year old, but she's not like me...and I was a bookworm put on this earth to study and go to university. <br /><br />I also don't think a yearly income around 100,000 dollars is anything to sneeze at, which is what the shortage of craftspeople will cause the incomes in this field to go to, if they're not there already. It's more than I make.PsychMomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4184539467031647989.post-31019352842832832912013-04-10T14:43:53.639-07:002013-04-10T14:43:53.639-07:00I agree on all counts. I especially wish Number 3...I agree on all counts. I especially wish Number 3 would get more attention. Suppose these kids "succeed" and end up getting better jobs than they otherwise would have. Doesn't that mean that some other kid now *doesn't* get that job? If all we're doing is giving some kids a competitive edge against other kids for the same set of jobs, how is the world a better place? If anything, it's worse, as now every kid has to work harder just to have a chance at a decent job.<br /><br />We should be trying to raise the standard of living for everyone, not just pitting kids against each other in a big competition for an insufficient number of decent jobs. These "rigorous" approaches to education do nothing toward that end.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07559356125770114400noreply@blogger.com